This is Uncomfortable February 8, 2024 Transcript

Note: Marketplace podcasts are meant to be heard, with emphasis, tone and audio elements a transcript can’t capture. Transcripts are generated using a combination of automated software and human transcribers, and may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting it.

 

 

Reema Khrais: [speaks Arabic] Hi Hana, thank you so much for responding to my message. Um so yeah we can talk via voice memos. I think it would be good just to start off and, Get to know you a little bit more. So, um, how old are you? Um, what was your life like before the war? Were you a student? Were you working? I’m excited to learn more about you. Um, okay. I’ll talk to you soon. Inshallah. Bye. 

 

Hana Albaioumy:  Hi Reema, thank you. Um, and I just love the way you pronounce the Arabic words. Okay, so my name is Hana and I am 33.  I’m not sure if you have seen my photos when you connected with me on Instagram, but I always,  I have always been told that I look younger than I am. [laugh] Um, what was my life like before the war? Uhhh ….

 

Reema: For weeks now, I’ve been exchanging voice memos with Hana Albaioumy. Hana lives in Gaza, which means for the last four months her life has been thrown into chaos. I first stumbled across her through Instagram. Her profile drew me in; she kinda reminded me of my friends.

But what I really admired was just how vulnerable she was in her most recent posts, how she didn’t shy away from sharing how she’d been coping since the war started. 

Since it’s hard to reach people in Gaza right now, Hana would send voice memos every few days, sharing pieces of her life with me. 

 

Hana: I have been married for seven years, I had a very quiet and nice life, and cozy house. I loved my life so much, and I loved my husband so much. I love him. I mean he’s still here. [laughs]

 

Reema: And every now and then, I also shared things about myself. 

 

Reema: Um, it’s so nice to learn more about you. I’m so surprised that you’re 33. Like you said, you do not look, um, 33. You look a lot younger. I’m also 33, and I’m also married, and I also don’t have kids, so we have all of that in common.

 

Reema: And there’s another very big thing we have in common: my family is also from Gaza. I grew up in the U.S., but most of my relatives currently live there. I’m not going to really talk about that in this story, but if you want to hear more about my family, I recommend you check out last week’s episode, “A conversation with Baba.” 

Anyway, back to Hana. 

Scrolling through her Instagram, I got glimpses of her old life. Her apartment was light and airy, with hanging plants and a cursive neon sign above the couch that read “loved and lucky.” In the mornings, she liked drinking a latte with coconut milk in her favorite floral mug, and in the evenings, she watched Korean dramas. She’d spontaneously sing and dance when music played at a restaurant. And on her 33rd birthday, her friends and family surprised her with beautifully wrapped gifts and massive silver balloons.

 

Hana: I know that everyone expects Gaza to be all the time, uh, you know, like just such a gray place with a lot of bombing and shelling all the time. But to be honest, when we don’t have a war, we do live a nice life. I mean, we, we, we try our best. 

 

Reema: Life in Gaza wasn’t easy, with the blockade that’s been in place for the last 16 years. But everything changed on October 7th of last year. That’s when Hamas fighters poured into southern Israel, took hostages and killed about 1200 people. 

In retaliation, Israel began a bombing campaign and ground invasion in the Gaza strip that has lasted for about four months and has led to wide-scale destruction. Gaza is a small enclave, about the size of Philadelphia, and it’s incredibly dense. Almost half the population are minors.

Israel’s bombardment has killed more 26,000 people, according to Gaza and UN officials. 40% of them are children. According to Oxfam, the daily death rate in Gaza is higher than that of any other 21st century conflict. 

And because of Israel’s siege, most people are drinking contaminated water and there’s limited electricity. People like Hana rely on solar panels to stay connected. 

Back in October, when Israel ordered that about a million people in northern Gaza evacuate their homes and find shelter in southern Gaza, Hana was in disbelief. 

 

Hana: It felt really, really horrible. I don’t know, it was the most difficult time, the most difficult moment in my life. Like no one ever imagined none of the scenarios, none of the response plans that we have ever prepared expected this kind of war. 

 

Reema: For Hana there’s a special irony to this: she works for an international humanitarian aid organization. She helps internally displaced people for a living. Overnight, Hana became one of them.

In the last few months, Hana has relocated several times with her family, each time going more south to try to avoid Israel’s bombardment. At one point, she was sheltering with about 100 people and only one toilet.

 

Hana: It was a nightmare, especially for women: you’re going to have some who have their periods. This is actually one of the most difficult situations to deal with, especially if you have no water around. 

 

Reema: Of all the voice memos Hana shared with me, I kept finding myself thinking about one of them. She was describing what it was like the day she fled her home and tried to find refuge. 

 

Hana: The moment I entered that shelter, I felt betrayed that, I mean, this is not the life I was working for and the type of life that I was hoping to have after all of this hard work. It was a mix of anger, sadness, feeling disappointed by the whole world, and I don’t know, by the universe.

 

Reema: I’m Reema Khrais and you’re listening to This Is Uncomfortable. 

Since late December, I’ve been in touch with Hana, and she’s shared multiple updates with me. 

This week, you’re going to hear intimate details of what it’s like to be in Gaza right now, of the daily onslaught of devastating news and the impossible financial calculations. 

And at the same time, you’re also going to hear a story of someone who, against all odds, tried her best to overcome her situation, to create a more promising future, only to be derailed by forces entirely out of her control. 

It’s a rare look at what it’s like to be a young woman in Gaza right now. And we wanted to bring this to you now, as it’s happening, as a small window into a massive news story that’s captivated the world. 

After chatting with Hana for about two weeks over voice memos, I really wanted to talk with her in real time. It took a while to coordinate though because of the time difference and the lack of electricity, but in early January, we eventually got on a Zoom call. It was about 10pm in Gaza. 

 

Hana: Hi, Reema. 

Reema: Hi, can you hear me okay 

Hana: Yes, I can, how are you? 

 

Reema: Right now Hana is in the city of Rafah, which is on the border with Egypt. She’s staying in an unfinished house with ten other families. They’re all sleeping on the floor. It’s loud and chaotic. 

But that night, I was surprised when she told me she was wrapping up her work day. It hadn’t occurred to me that she was still doing her job as bombs dropped around her. She was working at a nearby house her organization rents out. It was empty, she was there just with her husband.

 

Hana: So that’s why it’s very quiet.

Reema: Yeah, I was, I was surprised how quiet it is.

Hana: Yeah, now this feels paradise, so it’s amazing.

Reema: How often are you there?

Hana: Every day, and to be honest, it distracts me so I just work as long as I think I need or I can. 

 

Reema: Her employer doesn’t expect her to work. But she’s grateful to still have a regular salary and something to do. 

She helps educate people who’ve fled their homes on how to protect themselves. One thing her  organization does is make posters that are distributed around shelters in Gaza.

And they include guidance that she applies to her own life, like how you should avoid shrapnel from a nearby bomb by staying in the center of a house, away from windows. 

 

Hana: And if there are windows, we cover them with adhesive tape and with the curtains and some cardboard. 

Reema: Oh, wow. I’m sure your family is very grateful for you to be in the position that you’re in right now.

Hana: Yes. Not all of them, especially guys here. They sometimes make fun of all of these measures because they think, “Oh yeah, I mean, if it’s gonna come, it’s gonna come anyway.” I mean, talking about the bombs. 

Reema: Mmm.

Hana: I keep telling them that when it  helps you, you will not laugh. Some of them keep calling me the Windows Manager, because I just keep telling them about how to deal with windows.

 

Reema: But then she told me about a recent time when her window management paid off in a huge way.

 

Hana: One of the houses we stayed in Khan Younis, there was a building that was bombed 15 meters away from us.

 

Reema: While Hana and her husband were sleeping, the bomb shattered the windows, throwing the white curtains on top of them.

 

Hana: I woke up to the sound of the bombing, the smell of the, you know, the explosion and  the mix of all of these colors and sounds. For the first moment, I thought I am dead. Because it was all, it was all white and, you know, because of the curtain. And yeah, the whole window I mean, even the metallic part of it, it was all thrown inside the house, with some fragmentations and shrapnel. But I was thinking that, I mean, thanks God, even if it’s a piece of cloth, it protected us. That’s the reason why tell people to keep the curtains. We could have died, or least seriously injured.

Reema: Yeah. That’s actually, that’s huge. You protected your family, and you protected the people who were in the house, it sounds like.

Hana: Yeah, I, I hope so.

 

Reema: And she helped in other ways, too. When they fled their homes in October, because of her work, she already had an emergency bag prepared, and she’d told her family to do the same. She reminded them: don’t make it too heavy in case we need to run. 

 

Hana:  My sister has two beautiful daughters.  And  one of the moments that made me really sad is when their mom forced them to get rid of some stuff, which are toys mainly. So until now, when we ask them about the emergency bag, they get really sad because they didn’t bring anything of their toys or any of the cute stuff they like. But no one also expected that this is what’s going to happen. We all thought it’s going just to be a couple of days, a week maximum, and then we’re all going back to our houses. So I just took this emergency bag just in case, you know, just in case. 

Reema: Yeah, what did you have in those bags?

Hana: Just the very important, you know, documents, our ID cards, money, some bottles of water. If I was prepared to evacuate and leave to the south from my house, I could have, of course, took everything or like at least most of the things. I left Gaza without any clothes. I mean, everyone always makes fun of me because I have maybe the largest number of clothes in Gaza. 

Reema: [laugh]

Hana: I have a different dressing room, and that, that’s not something common in Gaza.

Reema: Oh, wow.

Hana: I have a lot. I love shopping.

Reema: Is there something specific that you wish you brought with you?

Hana: A lot. I’m so, I’m so connected to my stuff. But what I currently think of, the most important thing to me is my wedding albums and photos and my childhood photos, and all the photo drawer, I didn’t even open it. That’s the main thing that I wish I have brought with me.

Reema: Yeah, yeah. In one of the pictures that you sent me, I saw a cat. Did you bring your cat? 

Hana: Yes, of course. I brought my cat and my emergency bag, and that’s it.

Reema: Oh, what’s the name of your cat?

Hana: Luka.

Reema: He’s very cute.

Hana: Yeah.

Reema: How is Luka doing?

Hana: Oh, yeah. He’s, he’s, he’s depressed. I thought, to be honest, at that time, I thought I’m gonna bury him because I thought he’s gonna die. But then he managed to survive.

Reema: He’s adapting.

Hana: Yes, he is.

 

Reema: Hana is not sure if her apartment is still standing. She eventually heard from neighbors that her building got hit by a few missiles. She doesn’t know if she’ll have a home to return to. 

 

Hana: What is really complicated about being a Gazan is, you know, as a human being, you have your own journey, right? Can you hear me still? I guess I will lose, I lose connection in a bit and then it will come back because the electricity is cut and sometimes… 

Reema: Okay. Okay. I think, I think I lost you. 

 

Reema: The irony wasn’t lost on me that Hana was mid-sentence talking about what’s complicated about being Gazan, when her connection with the world dropped out. A few minutes later, Hana reconnected. 

 

Hana: Okay, I can hear you now. 

Reema: You’re back! Okay. 

Hana: So yeah, I was saying that being a Gazan adds another layer to the complexity of life, just as human beings, where after you try to find your own way, as a human being, with regards to dealing with money, your own mental health, childhood issues etc, something very out of your hands, you know, out of your control, comes and just stops you from anything else.

Reema: Well, in your voice messages that you sent me, that was the sentiment that stuck with me the most when you said that you felt betrayed by the universe. It makes me curious to hear a little bit more about your background and the things that you did that made you think you would never be in a situation like this. 

Hana: I mean I have been working hard, like really really hard. I didn’t have the best childhood. My father was not working. My mother used to work in some different jobs when we were kids. We couldn’t really, uh, get everything we want. Um, it wasn’t easy. It wasn’t easy at all.

 

Reema: In Gaza, it might not always be bleak and gray, but the economic situation is incredibly dire. Since Hamas came into power in 2007, Israel imposed a blockade on Gaza, with Egypt’s backing, that ultimately tanked the economy. 

The unemployment rate is above 40 percent and most of the population lives below the poverty line. And it’s hard to pursue economic opportunities outside of Gaza. The blockade makes it hard for people to leave, even to travel within Israel and to the West Bank.

Hana grew up as the eldest of five children, and so she always felt like she had to be the responsible one, the leader. And she didn’t mind being in the spotlight.  

 

Hana: I always was the girl who does the morning program in the school. I, I love to talk as you can see. [laugh] But I was not always happy with how I look, because I can see that there are better options. There are girls who are able to buy nice outfits. And one of the things that I always wanted to have is like the long coats, like winter coats. The girls who were able to do it, you know, their families are working and they have job,s and they are, you know, one of the wealthy families, but I was never able to get one, and that maybe explains I have loads of them now. 

 

Reema: As Hana grew older, as she watched her family struggle, she decided she wasn’t going to be poor as an adult. 

 

Hana:  I decided to stop this karma, as they describe it. And just to stop the circle where we were living. And it wasn’t easy, growing up, in such an unstable financial situation, you also grow up with a lot of beliefs about money. I had to change them. I have to work a lot on how to rebuild my own perspective about money. 

 

Reema: Hana tried her best to ignore the voices around her, the voices that told her it would be impossible to build wealth, or how being poor can be spiritually rewarding.

 

Hana: I stood against most of the norms and the traditions and the beliefs, beliefs of my community and the circumstances of how I grew up.

 

Reema: Sometimes those beliefs still echo in her mind, but she fights them by dreaming even bigger. 

 

Hana: I would like to start my own journey, and like to join a master degree and maybe to have a business later on and, you know, to change, like I would love to be a rich woman, like really rich. So I would love to build, I would love to have  wealthy life, and where I, where my, all 

Reema: Mm-hmm. 

Hana:  I mean, I love luxury and I love, uh, I love this kind of life, and I think I’m planning to be honest to, to, to be, uh, to, to work toward this life.

Reema: You said something earlier that I was curious to hear more about. You said that you were pushing back on traditional norms or, you know, doing things that weren’t always expected of you. What did you mean by that? 

Hana: You know, being a woman in, to some extent, a conservative society, is not the easiest thing, you know.

Reema: Yeah. 

Hana: The simplest example is that the pressure to get married at a younger age.

Reema: Yeah. 

Hana: I got married only at 26. 

Reema: Mm hmm, which is like considered late.

Hana: Yes, yes, because it starts earlier, like 20, 21, 22, 23 maximum. 

Reema: Yeah.

Hana: So that was one of them things, because I was against, uh, the traditional way of getting married. I just wanted to, you know, to continue going with my life and being, have financial stability, et cetera. I told my mom: “No, I will only get married for someone who loves me as Hana and accepts me and just that’s it. That’s the only way.” And it happened, later on. Um, but at that time, everyone was pushing my mom, everyone was telling her: “This is not… She doesn’t really know what she’s doing. She’s gonna miss the train,” da da da. You know?

Reema: Mm hmm.

Hana: So that’s one thing. And all the decisions that came after this big one were not easy in terms of, you know, deciding to work instead of getting married, deciding to start traveling without being married, the way I dressed up, uh, you know, the smallest and from the smallest to the biggest decision.

Reema: Well it’s interesting, I went  through that too, but obviously in my own way. It came up for me a lot in terms of like, you know, am I going to be with someone who’s not Muslim or who’s not Arab? Decisions around clothing and how conservative I want to be. It’s hard, and it’s something I struggled with throughout my 20s…

Hana: And you were not sure that. Yeah, exactly. You were not sure that you’re doing this because you wanted it or because you have been affected because… and that was the most, that was the most said sentence by me since, you know, growing up: I would say that I just, I would just like to have the option, you know, have the ability and the option to decide. And then…

Reema: Yeah, and then figure out what it is that you want.

Hana: Exactly. Exactly.

 

Reema: And Hana decided that she’d delay marriage, that while she’d still dress conservatively, she’d do it in her own way, and that after college, her first priority would be to make money. One of her first jobs was working as a translator. 

 

Reema: Do you remember one of the first times you got a check from work, when you first got money? 

Hana: Of course, yes. The very first job I got paid $500. That was from the first job I got. I still remember, I mean, it’s, it’s, it’s not a huge amount of money, of course, but I felt the power at that time. It might be funny because $500 are not really something to empower you, but I just felt that this is  the first step of where I want to go and to be able to do what I want.

 

Reema: She spent that first check on her mom. Hana told me her weakness might be long coats, but her real motivation has always been to help her family. 

Hana kept telling me about her life story late into the night. We connected on a bunch of topics, we talked about marriage, our physical health, how grateful we are for therapy. 

It was hard not getting carried away, to just talk about life. 

But I eventually brought us back to her current situation. 

 

Reema: What conversations have you all been having about what, what might come next?

Hana: I mean, this topic in specific is very big and very important, so maybe we can talk about it next time, if it’s okay?

Reema: Yeah let’s do that. 

Hana: I guess my mind is getting foggy now. I’m getting sleepy.

Reema: You should definitely go to sleep. Sorry for keeping you on for so long.

Hana: No, it’s okay. It was nice. I mean, I love to talk. Also it’s interesting talking to you. And, um…

Reema: It’s fun talking to you.

Hana: Like I, I believe that different, like similar souls or similar people get, you know, get in, in, in their, in the ways of each other. I I believe in this somehow.

Reema: I believe in that too. I do, too.

Hana: So in a better of a situation, we can, we can be friends. [laughter]

 

Reema: It was past midnight in Gaza when we finally said goodnight. 

 

Reema: Okay, I’ll talk to you soon. 

Hana: Okay, have a good day. Bye-bye.

Reema: Okay. Good night, bye. 

 

Reema: We made a plan to reconnect in a few days, assuming she’d be able to. That’s after the break. 

 

[BREAK]

 

 Reema: So how are you doing? What what’s happened these last few days since we talked? 

Hana: um,  I’m doing my best to be okay. The past few days were not the greatest…

 

Reema: In the five days since we last talked, Hana told me multiple people she knew had been killed from Israel’s bombardment. Including her mom’s really good friend who was sheltering in the same area as them. Hana found out through social media. 

 

Hana: The whole family were killed.

Reema: Oh wow.

Hana: Yeah, that was horrible. And I knew about it like for, for two days and I couldn’t tell my mom because she’s her friend, and my mom also has high blood pressure, and it’s not stable. So we tend to ask her not to use her mobile a lot and to check social media a lot because we, we’re always scared that she’s, um, you know, she gets, uh, emotionally affected more than it does to us.  

 

Reema: Her mom ended up hearing the news from someone else anyway. Hana wishes that she’d told her mom personally. There’s a lot she just doesn’t know how to say.

 

Hana: To be honest, I, now I’m not strong enough to see people in the very first days of, of their loss. That might feel…

Reema: Yeah.

Hana: I know, uh, bad, but, but I just didn’t know what to tell them, to be honest. I, I don’t know what to tell them or how to make them feel better. And…

Reema: Because there’s nothing, there’s nothing you can say.

Hana: Exactly. I mean, we, to be honest, it’s not, it’s sad, but we stopped counting. I mean, it’s just, we don’t even have now the luxury of, of grieving or mourning people who, who die actually. I lost a cousin, and what really made me sad is, um, my, my husband lost his sister, and then three weeks ago, he lost his, uh, brother, his very favorite brother. And then yesterday, his nephew. So a lot, I mean. At some moment you just, you know, you don’t feel, I mean, you feel sad, but it’s not the usual reaction or…

Reema: Of course not.

Hana: Yeah, it’s…

Reema: Do you feel like you just have to make yourself go numb a little?

Hana: Yes, exactly. You know, it’s not that we’re normalizing death. Of course not. But, but it’s just, yeah, it’s too much. It’s too much. I mean, I always think of how people will feel after the situation is over. I mean all the wounds will, you know, be open again. Because now we’re all in, you know, we’re all in the survival mode, you know, so we’re not…

Reema: Exactly.

Hana: Yeah, we’re not really processing anything. Here, to be honest, um, men do not easily cry. The Arab men, right? Maybe you know this.

Reema: Of course, I do know this very well.

Hana:  I mean, yesterday I was telling my husband, I mean, how do you feel? Just talk to me, say anything. I actually encouraged him to cry and feel sad, because if he doesn’t, then I know it will all affect his body and his mental health, because he will just hold things inside him.

Reema: That makes sense. Yeah I, you know, obviously I didn’t grow up in Gaza, but, yeah, being Palestinian, Palestinian-American, I know how hard it is to…  

Hana: Yeah.

Reema: …see vulnerability in men.

Hana: Yeah, yeah, of course.

 

Reema:I could hear someone moving around in the background. Hana told me it was her husband. I asked her in Arabic to tell him I say hi. 

 

Reema: [speaks Arabic] 

Hana: [speaks Arabic]

Reema: What is he doing?

Hana: Uh, I don’t know. He’s in the kitchen. I don’t know what he’s doing. I just hear noise. He loves kitchen. He’s the, he’s the one who cooks.

Reema: Hmm. Oh, nice, nice. What is his, uh, best dish?

Hana: Maqluba. You know maqluba, of course, you’re Palestinian.

Reema: Of course, of course.

 

Reema: It’s basically a huge pot of stewed meat, rice and vegetables. Maqlouba means “upside down”  That’s because when you serve it, you flip the pot over. 

 

Hana: It takes a lot of work. Yesterday we managed to do it the first time since the beginning of the war. So we’re super happy. I will send you a picture now, once we finish. But we finally found, you know, meat, and we finally found the vegetables that we use all at once. I mean, we found potatoes, eggplants, tomatoes. So it was, wow. So we said, we should do maqlouba today.

Reema: That’s amazing. Where did you get all that food from?

Hana: There is a market here, but the vegetables are not, um, are not always found, and it’s super, super, super expensive.

Reema: Yeah. How expensive?

Hana: It’s like, um, I’m not the one who buys vegetables usually, but basically the other day we have bought one potato for about… Just one moment. [speaks Arabic]

 

Reema: She turned to her husband to ask him how much one potato costs right now…

 

Hana: So, one potato for about, um, uh, 0.5 dollar. So like half a dollar, and that’s not normal at all in Gaza.

 

Reema: According to her husband, 50 cents used to get you four or five potatoes, not just one. 

 

Hana: And even now thinking of the daily needs, I, I spent a lot of money on a lot of stuff, but, but this time, I think of things before buying them, and I don’t like it to be honest. I don’t like it.

Reema: Mm hmm. You’re not used to it.

Hana: When I see anything, even now during the war, I just want to buy for me and for my siblings and for those I love. But now I keep thinking, I don’t know what’s gonna happen tomorrow. And I am not a big fan of, what is the, um, the saying that we have here in Arabic: saving the, the white pennies…

Reema: What is it in Arabic?

Hana: [speaks in Arabic] It’s like ‘keeping the white pennies for the dark days,’ something like this. I’m not really a big fan of this. It feels really horrible to keep some canned food aside because you are still expecting the worst, you know? I mean, because if this, if the worst has not come, I mean, what we’re living?

Reema: And I guess to your point, it’s so hard to think about the future right now, and so I can imagine that makes it hard to know how to spend your money. 

Hana: Yes of course. So two days, just two days before the war started… 

Reema: Mm-hmm.

Hana: …we were thinking of buying our own apartment. And at that night, just two days before the war, my husband, he was about to go out and, and, you know, give the landlord some part of the money so he can you know, book it for us.

Reema: No way.

Hana: And then I just told him that, no, this, I just don’t feel it’s right. So we stopped buying it. And, you know, two days later, the war happened. And all of these buildings that we have been looking at and seeing as options, they were all destroyed. So I was like, thanks God, I don’t know how this happened.

Reema: So last time when we were talking, I asked you this question, and then, um, we, we had to stop the interview because it was getting late. I’m curious, you know, what decisions you and your family are weighing right now about what you might do next, or what might be possible even? What kinds of conversations are you all having right now?

Hana: yeah, now the conversations we’re having are most of the time about how we can survive. For example, getting out of Gaza. Because to be honest, this is number one. Not, not for the whole family. Some of them are okay to stay, or they would like to stay. They don’t want to leave. And some of them, including myself and my husband are considering to leave. But also, it’s not just about deciding,

Reema: Right.

Hana: You know, it’s also about the crossing. It’s about being allowed to.

 

Reema: Gaza’s borders with Israel and Egypt are effectively closed. But there have been a few workarounds, including Gazans coordinating with brokers in Egypt to help them get through.

 

Hana: and this might be a bit sensitive to talk about, but this is the truth that people have to pay money and a huge amount of money to be able to get out. 

Reema: Yeah. How much money exactly? Do you have a sense?

Hana: Yes, I mean, for the past three months we have been hearing numbers and we have been trying to contact people to get out. And the last number we have got was, um, uh, 10,000.

Reema: $10,000 for one person.

Hana: Yes, $10,000. And this is horrible because I know that there are very, very few percentage, a very small percentage in Gaza can afford this. But even if they do, even if they do, it’s nonsense. It’s it’s crazy. Um, to be honest, I am considering this with my husband, but not with 10,000. It’s too much.

 

Reema: It’d be too much because well, it’s a lot of money, but if she’s going to leave, she can’t imagine doing it without bringing her mom and sister with her. 

 

Hana: And if we’re going to pay, it’s just going to be every single penny we have saved. 

Reema: If you’d bought the house, would you’ve been able to afford leaving? 

Hana: No, of course not.

Reema: No, right?

Hana: I wouldn’t have any single, uh, dollar with me because my savings will be, um, about just, you know, third of it, third of the amount.

Reema: Wow.

Hana: So, yeah, we were very lucky.

Reema: And can you tell me a little bit more about why some people within your family wouldn’t want to leave? 

Hana: It’s mainly, it’s, it’s about money, but people have started labeling those who left, to be honest, and that’s a big thing.

Reema: In what, in what sense? 

Hana: They have left, you know, their home, and they are not resilient enough to stay. They are linking what’s happening to the Nakba time where, where, you know, our grandparents have to leave…

 

Reema: The Nakba, or “Catastrophe” in English, is how Palestinians refer to what happened during the creation of Israel in 1948, when hundreds of thousands of Palestinians were expelled from their homes. 

During that violent upheaval, many Palestinians evacuated and were never allowed back home, to what has now become Israel. So that fear hangs over many people today, that history could repeat itself.

Hana told me it feels like an impossible situation: stay put and risk your life, or leave and spend your life savings. 

 

Reema: It just, it just feels so twisted or perverse that you’re essentially putting a price tag on your safety and therefore your life. 

Hana: Exactly. It’s, it’s frustrating. If I have the amount of money, even if I’m going to start from scratch, even if I’m going to pay all the savings, I’m going to go for it. It’s just, it’s, I, I don’t think we can take any more of this.

 

Reema: I had that conversation with Hana a few weeks ago. In the days following, I tried to get in touch with her again, but my messages weren’t going through. Gaza was experiencing the longest communications blackout since the beginning of the war. Day after day, I’d wake up, waiting for her reply. I worried if she was OK. 

Then, one morning, I finally got notification. She was back online and wanted to get on Zoom right away. 

 

Reema: Hi, can you hear me? 

Hana: Yes, I can hear you now. How are you?

Reema: Oh, wow. I’m okay. How are you? 

Hana: I’m okay. You’re the first one I’m speaking to after the internet.

Reema: Oh really…

 

Reema: I could tell she sounded a little different. A bit more somber. She was sick. She said everyone is getting sick from the contaminated water and lack of fresh food. And it’s difficult to get medical care since none of Gaza’s hospitals are fully functional anymore.

 

Hana: It’s just it became the new normal, like getting a stomach ache, and like this feeling of food poison, you know? Like most of the kids and adults have diarrhea, and they are vomiting. And now, I have fever now while I’m talking to you.

 

Reema: Even with the fever, she said it was nice to reconnect with me. Gives her a sense of normalcy. 

Especially because lately, things have only gotten more terrifying. Israel’s troops are pushing farther south and are planning a new ground assault on Rafah. That’s where Hana and more than half of Gazans are currently sheltering, following Israel’s evacuation orders.

Rafah is a very small city, and the population has increased fivefold with the influx of people. Most Gazans are crammed into makeshift shelters and tents.

Hana says they’re all terrified. She doesn’t know where else they can go.

 

Hana: We have been doing what they have been requesting over the past three months. I mean, we have evacuated from Gaza. We have been to Khan Younis. We have left Khan Younis. We have been asked to go to Rafah. We’re now in Rafah, and that’s the only place that everyone has now.  And it’s not even safe. So it’s just scaring, actually, everybody. The fact that they might do this.

Reema: Yeah. Just, just to be clear, like Rafah is right by the border in Egypt. 

Hana: Yes.

Reema: So you’re already cornered.

Hana: Exactly. I mean, we have the sea and we have Egypt, so they can, they will be the only exits for people. I don’t know what’s going to happen. I don’t know. No one really knows. 

 

Reema: This fearful waiting and also not having internet for nearly two weeks, took a real toll on her. 

 

Hana: I was almost depressed, I guess, in a way or another. I was not really busy with anything, like I didn’t even have books downloaded on my mobile, uh, movies, nothing, literally nothing. 

Reema:  when you say that you’re depressed, like, what does that look like? Are you just not talking? Are you lying down a lot?  

Hana:  Just doing nothing, basically, and feeling like doing nothing. For example, um, waiting for the time to get out of Gaza or find a way to, to leave, it’s not motivating anymore. And one of the greatest fears that I always tell my family about is that I don’t want to reach a point where I feel that it is okay, it’s okay to die. Or it’s not okay, it’s it doesn’t matter… 

Reema: Yeah.

Hana: …to die or live anymore. And I just feel like this is what I try to avoid all the time. It, it’s just very, you know, very scary.

Reema: Yeah is there something you do or think of to help pull you out of that dark place?

Hana: I just keep thinking how I felt when I overcame the exact same feeling before in my life, like for personal issues. I just keep reminding myself that I felt that life is worth living and what I went through is a temporary case, and nothing really deserves that I lose my precious life or like all my dreams and my future life that I’m dreaming of. 

 

Reema: We talked for a bit longer before logging off. She told me she was going to sleep, and drink some hot water with lemon.

That weekend, I messaged her again. She told me after our call, she went to bed and didn’t get up for a couple days. But once she did, she felt somewhat refreshed. And motivated. 

She told me she started applying for jobs outside of Gaza. Who knows, maybe it could lead to something. 

Something Hana told me over and over again in our conversations is just how much she hates when people think of her just as a victim, when they define her and other Gazans by their suffering. It’s okay to sympathize, she told me, but her life is more dynamic, more expansive than just that. 

Over these last couple months, I could hear in our conversations just how determined she is to preserve an image of herself, and of her future, that’s not plagued by this current nightmare. How much she’s fighting feelings of hopelessness. 

She told me she found it comforting when we talked about things outside this moment, like when she shared the story of how she met her husband at a movie screening of ‘Life of Pi’ or how freeing it felt to dance around her apartment with her sisters. 

There’s one memory in particular she shared with me that I keep thinking about, when she talked about her favorite cafe in Gaza. 

 

Hana: It’s like on the 9th, I guess 9th or 11th floor. So you can actually see all of Gaza. But it was always a nice place, we liked. We go there, and we eat pizza, and we smoke argileh, and…

Reema: Argileh. That’s hookah.

Hana: Hookah, yes. Listening to you know, Umm Kulthum or any classic song, and this is my favorite moment.

Reema: This is a silly question, but what’s your favorite hookah flavor?

Hana: Um, we call it, um, [speaks Arabic] I don’t know what is it actually?

Reema: Like apple?

Hana: Yes, like two apples. [laughs]

 

Reema: As Hana talked about the café, I could imagine her there on the rooftop, joking with her friends, swaying to the music. 

 

Hana: This is, this is my favorite moment because it’s like very peaceful.

Reema: Yeah, I’m sad that I never got to experience that in Gaza.

Hana: Inshallah you will at some point. 

Reema: Yeah, who knows? I mean, I definitely wanna be able to go back, you know, whenever, whenever I can.

Hana: Inshallah. We can invite you for the best seafood.

Reema: Oh yeah?

Hana: Made at home. My husband does a lot of nice dishes.

Reema: Oh, that sounds tasty.

Hana: The best. 

Reema: Yeah, that sounds lovely.

Hana: Who knows? I mean, uh, at some point Gaza will, will, will go back to Gaza again. I don’t know how many years this will take, but, but I’m sure. I mean, people of Gaza are very resilient. Not because they chose to but because they have to. I mean, I can’t now talk about the future. 

Reema: Yeah, it’s hard. 

Hana: I can’t see myself able to do anything afterwards. But I’m sure Gaza will be rebuilt again.

 

Reema: Over the last week, airstrikes have increased in Rafah, and a ground invasion is expected imminently. Yesterday I texted Hana, asking her how she’s doing. She responded with two words “still alive.” 

If you want to follow Hana on social media, you can find her on Instagram. Her handle is @Hana_withlove

If you have any thoughts about this story, or just wanna shoot us a note, you can always email me and the team at uncomfortable@marketplace.org, we love hearing from you all.

Also for this week’s newsletter, I’m sharing behind-the-scenes details on how we coordinated these interviews with Hana, so be sure to check that out. And as usual, we’ll also include recommendations on things to read, cook or listen to. If you haven’t already signed up for it, you can do that by going to marketplace.org/comfort 

This episode was produced by Hannah Harris Green and me, Reema Khrais. 

The episode got additional support from Caitlin Esch, our producer Alice Wilder and our intern Marika Proctor. 

Zoë Saunders is our senior producer.

Our editor is Jasmine Romero.

Sound design and audio engineering by Drew Jostad.

Bridget Bodnar is Marketplace’s Director of Podcasts

Francesca Levy is the Executive Director of Digital.

Neal Scarborough is Vice President and general manager of Marketplace.

And our theme music is by Wonderly.

Alright we’ll be back with a new episode next week.