The push for electric vehicle adoption got a bit more uncertain with the election of Donald Trump. While reports of “EV death” have been greatly exaggerated, sales growth has slowed, and carmakers have pulled back on aggressive targets.

Marketplace’s Meghan McCarty Carino may be part of that trend. She recently sold her 2019 Volkswagen e-Golf, which had 120 miles of range, and she says, after a lot of agonizing, decided not to get another EV just yet.

But McCarty Carino worries, what will Jack think?

Jack Stewart is a former Marketplace reporter, the current associate director of sustainability and social impact at Edelman, and an expert on all things tech and transportation. He convinced McCarty Carino to buy her first EV back in 2019, so she asked for his thoughts on her decision to go back to gas. The following is an edited transcript of their conversation.

Jack Stewart: I’m absolutely not disappointed in you. I’m really interested to learn about how you’re going to make this decision. What’s really interesting to me is we’re at this crux point now because the early wisdom about EVs was always, once they reach price parity with gas cars, and once the range got above around 200 miles, especially above 300 miles, consumers would just flock to them. The $35,000 price point was always cited and that was what Elon Musk used as his target for the Tesla Model 3 when that was first announced. Now, with the tax credit, you can get several really good EVs for that price with great ranges. And yet, we’re seeing this flux, if you like, in consumer demand. So, tell me why you’re considering this.

Meghan McCarty Carino: When I bought the car and for the first few years I had it, I was super enthusiastic about it. I love how pure electric vehicles drive. And I thought really carefully about getting into a new EV with better tech, faster charging, and a bigger battery with a longer range. But ultimately, there were kind of two big things that held me back, and let’s talk about the first one, and that is concerns about public charging. I try to go to these chargers and invariably, in the last couple years, there will be a car parked at it that’s not an EV, or there will be a number of people parked waiting to use the charger. Often the charger will be broken. This was a big deal for me because I didn’t have a charger at home for a long time because I’m a renter, which is issue number two. So, the public charging thing, I think this is a big topic, right?

Stewart: I have a couple of thoughts. Southern California, where you live, of course, is one of the places where EVs have been most widely adopted, so perhaps a victim of its own success. But yes, unless we get the charging infrastructure built out and people have confidence in it, then it’s going to be really hard to convince people to change their habits and to reduce the level of convenience they feel they have from gas cars. And it’s been a major push of the Biden administration. The 2021 Bipartisan Infrastructure Law allocated $5 billion to build charging stations along highway corridors, and as of this summer, only eight of those have actually been built, apparently, because the permitting process for those, which varies state by state, and especially across state lines, I can imagine, is a nightmare. The Biden administration has said that they want to take their time and get this right, and now the rollout is going to really speed up, but that is just not keeping pace with what consumers are demanding then, by the sounds of it.

McCarty Carino: So, in the pickle I find myself in, I have been considering some sort of secondary options, maybe some bridges between going full gas again. What about plug-in hybrids? Are those a good option?

Stewart: It depends on whether you’re going to plug it in. A plug-in hybrid works well for people who religiously plug it in every night. They only have small batteries compared even to your car, but they’ll give you 10 or even 40 miles of all EV range for your first 40 miles of the day, and then you’ve always got the gas engine there as a backup. The trouble is, the evidence shows people don’t really plug them in, and then you’re just carrying around this hugely complex drive train with a gas engine and a motor and a big, heavy battery that’s like having people in the back seat the whole time and you’re not actually using it. To my mind, they’re a compromise. If you can find a very efficient gas car, you might actually be better doing that if you can’t plug in regularly.

McCarty Carino: And what about the more traditional hybrids? At the time that I bought the EV, my hesitation about a Prius or something similar in 2019 was that I felt they didn’t drive very nicely, and they were kind of funky. There weren’t a lot of enthusiast cars available — not that I’m a driving enthusiast, but I care about these things for unknown reasons. But, I feel like there have been some advances in hybrid powertrains.

Stewart: Yes, they certainly drive very nicely. You can get some hybrids where that sort of crossover between electric and the gas engine cutting in is almost imperceptible. Hybrids are certainly something that the manufacturers are looking towards as a bridging step, and they seem to be something that consumers are much more comfortable with. So, are they the gateway drug to EVs? It could also be consumers are comfortable with them because they’re getting them for a really good price, because a lot of them do still qualify for various incentives and credits, and then they’re not actually taking advantage of them by not plugging them in. So, it’s unclear exactly what’s going on there, but it’s worth going out and driving some, I think. I mean, what’s your feeling? Why not just go for an EV but one of the more modern ones with a much longer range? Then you’d only have to plug it in one-third as often.

McCarty Carino: Partially, there are rational reasons. The limitation of not being able to install a level two charger at home feels like a big one with a car with a longer range. Also, honestly, I’m mad. I got to a point where I was so frustrated and I would have times when I couldn’t make it to a doctor’s appointment in my EV without relying on public charging, and I, at this point, refused to do that. So, I would take a ride share. I would pay maybe $100 to take a ride share to and from an appointment, because I had lost confidence in my car to make it there, and I just felt like this car is a nice car, I like the car, but it does not have the full utility and convenience of a non-EV.

Stewart: That’s frustrating. It’s really interesting, and I think it’s something that environmentalists like me need to take on and recognize. I feel responsible for having recommended this to you. I think the point I’d really like to get across to people, though, is, let’s not lose track of the bigger picture here. Decarbonization is the most critical challenge that the planet and all of our economies are facing, and we are seeing progress. Transportation accounts for around 28% of U.S. greenhouse gas emissions, road vehicles are a large part of that. We need to make a change. The danger is now that the narrative swings too far the other way, and we go from excitement about EVs to complete disillusionment when people hear stories like this. Yes, EVs are not working for some people and the truth is, maybe they’re not for everybody, and we need a mix of vehicle types in the future. But for a lot of people, they are absolutely awesome. So, I think we’re in this sort of, like, trough of disillusionment period. There was a huge amount of excitement, there was maybe too much hype, and at some point, we’ll plateau with what’s realistic amongst expectations and amongst what consumers actually want. But I do think we’ll get there.

More on this

As we noted, the future of public policy to incentivize electric vehicle adoption in the U.S. is a bit up in the air.

President-elect Donald Trump isn’t known for his fondness for EVs, and he’s widely expected to roll back at least some of the Biden administration’s policies — like tax credits and emissions standards.

Though the New York Times reported last week that the country’s Big Three automakers are hoping to convince Trump to keep more stringent rules in place because they’ve already made such big investments to meet them.

Meanwhile Trump ally Elon Musk has reportedly backed cutting tax credits for EVs, which currently take up to $7,500 dollars off the sticker price of an electric car.

The position may seem counterintuitive for the CEO of Tesla, but the tax credits help boost its competitors more. Because unlike pretty much every other car company, Tesla actually makes a profit on its electric vehicles thanks to its long head start and efficient manufacturing.

I also have to report that since we recorded this conversation with Jack, I bought a new car. Well, a used car actually. I traded my Volkswagen e-Golf for a Volkswagen gas Golf, because what can say? I love a Golf.

Though I’m really just biding my time until Rivian releases its R3 EV in 2027 because it looks like the cutest futuristic 1970s Golf.  

If I can get myself a better home charging situation by then, I’m in.